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Concurrent Degree
Students
Concurrent Degrees
within the Nicholas School
MEM/MF
If you want to receive both MEM and MF degrees from the
Nicholas School,
you may do so by completing 48 credits under your primary
degree plus an
additional 24 credits under the second degree and by choosing
a masters
project topic that combines the subject matter of both degree
programs.
You must satisfy the course requirements for both degree
programs. It usually takes 6 semesters to complete the MEM/MF
combination; only with very careful course selection can
it be completed in 5 semesters. To
facilitate course planning, you will have a coursework advisor
for each
program (but just one MP advisor). Fill out a course planning
form for
each of the degree programs, showing 48 credits under the
primary degree
and 24 credits under the secondary degree. To show where
you are using
courses taken for credit under the primary degree to meet
requirements
of the secondary degree, put parentheses around those courses
(to
indicate that the substance of the course meets the program
requirements, but the credits do not count toward the 24
for the second
degree). Attend the MP seminar sessions for your primary
degree. And,
current students advise getting going on the MP in first
summer; don't
wait until the second.
Concurrent Degrees
with other schools at Duke
- MEM or MF with JD, MBA, MPP, MAT
- JD/MA
Remember that when you commit to the concurrent degree program,
with reduced credits for each degree, you won’t receive
either degree until you’ve completed all requirements
for both degrees, including your masters project (and, in
the case of concurrent MPP programs, MPP masters project).
Concurrent Degrees
with non-Duke Schools
It is possible to make special arrangements to do a NS
concurrent degree program with degree programs at other universities
(e.g., UNC Law School, UNC Planning department, UNC Business
School, or other universities). The credit and financial
arrangements for the NS degree are essentially the same
as for concurrent degrees with other Duke programs (36 credits,
3 semesters in residence, 3 semesters of NS tuition). The
credit and tuition arrangements for the other university
are at the discretion of that school.
Degree Program Sequencing
There is room for some flexibility in how you sequence
your concurrent degree programs, but here are the usual patterns
for each concurrent degree. If you are beginning your studies
in your other school, rather than in the NS, be sure to
come to the NS early in your first semester to meet with
your NS advisor, who will help you coordinate course selection
in your two programs.
Master of Arts in Teaching (MAT) – Do the MAT
first (one summer plus the following academic year),
followed by 3 semesters in the NS (fall, spring, fall).
(It is possible to come to the NS first, starting in
January, but the MAT program needs to know exactly when
you will be coming into that program in order to arrange
student teaching assignments.) Sometimes MAT courses
can satisfy prerequisites needed for the NS (e.g., statistics).
MAT credits: 30; NS credits: 36.
Master of Public Policy (MPP) – It is generally
preferable for students wishing to pursue this concurrent degree
to begin their studies with the first academic year in public
policy, taking 27 credits and then completing the required
MPP summer internship. The second and third years are
spent in the Nicholas School, completing both NS and MPP
coursework, including PUPPOL 307 and 308, and the NS and
MPP masters projects. Alternatively, students who have
completed the Nicholas School prerequisites can begin with
one year in the Nicholas School and then go to Public Policy
for the second year, returning to the Nicholas School for
their final semesters. Students who start with two semesters
in the Nicholas School and then go to Public Policy may be
waived out of some of the first-year Public Policy courses.
Students lacking NS prerequisites should start in Public
Policy. Students following either sequence should consult
with advisors from the other program during their first year
in order to choose Public Policy and Nicholas School masters
projects on related topics. Most students will need three
years to complete both sets of coursework and both master's
projects. Public Policy credits: 39; Nicholas School
credits: 36.
The Public Policy portion of the concurrent MEM/MPP degree requires
a total of 39 credit hours, to include PUBPOL 307 and 308
in the last year of Public Policy study. Normally, students
will be fully enrolled in Public Policy the first year of
their concurrent program (27 credit hours), perform a required
summer internship that first summer, shift to the MEM program
for one or two years, and finally be concurrently enrolled in
Public Policy and the MEM program in the last year.
Juris Doctorate (JD) – Concurrent students
usually begin with the Law School for 2 semesters, but it
is also possible to begin with 2 semesters in the NS. Spend
the next 2 semesters taking courses in the other school.
Spend the last 4 semesters taking a mix of Law and NS courses;
you’ll need to have an NS PIN number for any semester
where you want some of your credits to count toward your
NS degree and some toward your Law degree; the Law School
doesn’t use PIN numbers. Law credits: 72; NS credits
36.
JD/Master of Arts (MA) – Law courses for this program
begin during the summer. It is usually easier to take all
Law courses during your first fall semester, then begin
mixing Law and NS courses in subsequent semesters, for
a total of 3 academic years, plus the first summer. Law
credits: 72; NS credits: 30.
Master of Business Administration (MBA) – Concurrent degree
students usually begin with one full year in the NS, then
a full year in Fuqua; this works out better for Fuqua summer
internships and for those going to Kenan-Flagler at UNC,
allows them to establish NC residency, but it is possible
to begin with a year in either school. Then spend the next
year in the other school. In the third year, take a combination
of NS and Fuqua courses; you'll need a PIN number even during
the semesters where you are not taking NS courses. Fuqua
credits: 65; NS credits: 36.
Note for CEMs: CEM students in concurrent degree programs
who want to spend one or more semesters in Beaufort
will need to be exceptionally attentive to coursework
planning because most of your course requirements will
have to be completed in Durham.
Coursework Advising in the Nicholas School
-
Consult your coursework advisor and/or Director
of Professional Studies.
Each professional program area has a coursework advisor
for concurrent degree students (either the program chair or
someone else designated by him/her). Lynn Maguire, the
Director of Professional Studies, is the overall advisor
for the concurrent degree programs. If you have questions that
can’t be resolved at the program level, please consult
Lynn.
-
Satisfy all NS program requirements.
The general rule for concurrent degree students completing
MEM or MF programs is that you must satisfy the substance
of all NS program requirements. It’s generally possible
to do this within a 36-credit program by (1) planning
your coursework for both degrees with NS program requirements
in mind; (2) giving up most "free" electives,
and (3) counting courses taken in your non-NS program
toward the substance of NS program requirements (but not
toward your 36 units of credit for the NS degree).
When you fill out your NS program planning worksheet,
you can indicate which requirements will be satisfied
in substance by coursework from your non-NS degree by
listing those courses in parentheses. Remember not to
count the credits from those courses toward the 36 units
you need in the NS.
Sometimes concurrent degree students have to take one or
two credits beyond the required 36 in order to complete
all their NS program requirements. If, despite your
best efforts, it appears that some element of the NS
program must be slighted, it should be the area where
you have the most coursework from your non-NS program
or from your undergraduate degree. For example, a concurrent JD/MEM student in Ecosystem Science and Management with
very extensive undergraduate coursework in ecology might
take one fewer fundamental ecology courses than required.
Your advisor should put a note on your course planning
sheet and documentation in your advising file indicating
agreement with this part of your plan, so that it doesn’t
cause trouble when your transcript is reviewed prior
to graduation.
MP Advising
MP Deadlines – Since concurrent degree students are often
on a different "sequence" than students in the
regular 4-semester program, you may have to take extra responsibility
for making sure you are keeping up with MP deadlines. Use
the semester in which you intend to graduate to work backwards
and figure out when you will need to meet deadlines for the
MP proposal, complete MP draft, etc. For example, May graduates
should file an MP prospectus and choose an MP advisor approximately
a year before graduation and they should have proposals in
by the 6th week of the fall semester preceding their May
graduation. December graduates should file prospectuses and
choose MP advisors late in the fall semester about a year
before their expected graduation, and their proposals should
be in by the 6th week of the following spring semester. The
idea is to allow the same amount of time between the intermediate
deadline and the final deadline as in the timetable presented
in the MP
guidelines. Note that for some concurrent students, this
may mean having to settle on an MP topic and write a prospectus
during the first semester you spend in the Nicholas School.
For other concurrent students, this may mean preparing a prospectus
or a proposal during a semester when you are taking all
or part of your courses in another school. When in doubt,
verify with your advisor or program chair what deadlines
you need to meet.
MP Seminar -- Each program has a 1-credit MP seminar
(ENVIRON 398.xx), which students sign up for each semester,
receiving one credit on successful completion of all activities
in the final semester. MP seminar activities include program
meetings to discuss MP proposals, required modules in graphics
and public speaking, etc. You may need to attend some of
these meetings while you are enrolled in your other degree
program depending on the semesters you’ll be taking NS
courses. (See suggestions below on making sure you are
on NS email lists even while enrolled in your other degree
program.) For example, since the required graphics and
public speaking modules may be given only in the spring
or fall term, concurrent degree students who will be enrolled
in the NS for only one spring or fall term may find it
advantageous to attend these modules while they are enrolled
elsewhere.
MPs and Internships – It’s very common, but not
universal, for NS students to use material from summer
internships as the basis for their MPs. Some concurrent degree
programs also have expectations for summer work (e.g., work
with MPP masters project client for MPP, summer law job
for JD) or summer study (e.g., for first year JD/MA students
or for incoming MAT students). Concurrent degree
students need to look at the sequence of semesters they’ll
be spending in the NS vs. the other school with an eye to
when they could do summer work leading to an MP and how
to have adequate NS coursework as background for that summer’s
work.
MPP – Concurrent MPP
students have both MPP and NS masters projects to complete.
Since MPs are often associated with summer internships, the
usual MEM/MPP sequence may leave only one semester after
your summer as an MEM student to complete the NS MP, which
is awfully rushed (as of Fall 08, there will always be two
semesters). It’s a good idea to try to coordinate the topics
of your MPP and NS masters projects, so that you can be getting
background for one while working on the other. Remember,
however, that the MPP and NS MPs have different requirements
and different aims and should be two separate pieces of work.
Consult with your NS advisor when you are choosing your MPP
masters project topic, and vice versa, in order to coordinate
topics for both MPs.
To obtain a more detailed explanation of MPP/MEM registration,
Master’s Projects, Leave of Absence policy, etc, click
here
>
Communications
We have an email list for concurrent degree students (profjoint@nicholas.duke.edu),
and concurrent degree students should also be included on program
email lists. However, you should be alert to a couple of
communications difficulties that can arise for concurrent students.
During the semesters when you are not registered in the NS,
you may not be included automatically on the NS email lists.
Be sure to ask to be added, so that you’ll receive messages
about program meetings, required modules, MP deadlines, etc.
Even when you are registered in the NS, check to be sure
that you are on the right program email lists to receive
messages about "first-year" and "second-year"
activities and deadlines. Because concurrent degree students
are not on the standard four-semester plan, you’ll have
to make sure that you are on the list or lists that are
appropriate for your stage of completion of MP requirements
(you may need to be on both the first and second year lists,
for example).
Registration/Financial Aid Tips
-
Make friends with your Registrars, who can help solve
registration problems (which seem to be common for concurrent degree students).
-
If you don’t get a bill, ask (otherwise, you may find
yourself owing two semesters’ tuition at once). If your
bill seems wrong (as happens frequently for concurrent degree
students), complain (politely, of course).
-
Use ACES to check that your registration is correct in
each degree program.
Other Tips for Specific Concurrent Degree
Programs
MEM/MF
Lorna Wright is an MEM/MF concurrent degree student who
is willing to correspond with prospective students. Here's
Lorna's Nicholas School curriculum
>.
MBA
- The Nicholas School of the Environment
applauds students wishing to pursue
the professional Master of Environmental Management or
Master of Forestry degree concurrently
with another professional degree, such as the Master of
Business Administration. In order to facilitate the application
and admissions process, the Nicholas School will accept
valid GMAT scores in lieu of the GRE under the following
conditions:
- The applicant
is applying simultaneously to the Nicholas School for
the MEM or MF and to the Fuqua School of Business at
Duke or the Kenan-Flagler School of Business at the
University of North Carolina in Chapel Hill for the
MBA. The applicant must indicate on his/her application
that he/she is a concurrent degree applicant so that
the admissions committee will know to consider the
GMAT score in the admission review process. Students
applying solely to Kenan-Flagler and not to Fuqua must
have official GMAT scores sent to the Nicholas School,
Duke code 5156. The GMAT score must be valid and official
at the time of application.
- The applicant
is already enrolled in either the Fuqua School or Kenan-Flagler
and decides to apply for the MEM or MF as a concurrent
degree. In their Nicholas School application the student
must specify which MBA program he/she is currently
enrolled in. In the case of a current Kenan-Flagler
student, the applicant must have official, valid GMAT
scores sent to the Nicholas School, Duke code 5156.
Regretfully the Nicholas School
cannot accept LSAT scores in lieu of GRE scores for
those applicants who are applying to the Nicholas School
and the Duke Law School in order to pursue the MEM
or MF concurrently with the JD.
- Since Fuqua courses are usually given MTh or TuF (as
well as in different time blocks from the rest of Duke),
students taking classes in both Fuqua and NS in the same
semester can experience a lot of conflicts. It is important
to realize that you have to look at both of Fuqua’s terms
each semester when scheduling NS courses so that there
will not be a conflict.
- The MBA first year electives include a decision
models course (Decision 312), which may be used to satisfy
the substance (not the credit) for a NS quantitative course
with permission of your NS academic advisor. (Another Fuqua
core course, Decision 311, Probability and Statistics duplicates
too much of NS prerequisite level material to count as
a NS quantitative course.)
- The MBA job interview schedule in the fall term can pose
scheduling conflicts with NS courses.
Here is an example of
a course plan for a MEM/Fuqua MBA concurrent degree student. >
- Brandon Little
is a
concurrent NS MEM student in Environmental Economics and Policy
with UNC Kenan-Flagler MBA program who is
willing to correspond with prospective students. Here's
Brandon's Nicholas
School curriculum (note: this is not
entirely complete, but it shows examples of Nicholas
School courses that may be taken to complement the Kenan-Flagler
MBA offerings).
Law/MEM or MF
- If you are in the EEP program, where Environmental
Law is a core course, you will want to take this course
for Law credits rather than for NS credits.
- EEP concurrent students may want to take their 3 science
courses in a variety of areas, rather than in just one,
for broader preparation for environmental law.
- Students in science-oriented MEM programs, such as
CSP or WAR, should try to take all the required science
courses for their MEM degrees during the year they spend
in the NS, since it may be difficult to schedule these
in conjunction with Law courses during the 3rd and 4th
years.
- Although usually students enrolled in NS can only take
one Law School course per semester, it is possible to get
permission from Law School registrar to take more than
one if it would help in scheduling courses for concurrent degree
programs.
Law/MA
- For students in the EEP concurrent MA program, your 24 units
of NS coursework must include the EEP core courses (except
for Environmental Law, which you’ll take while registered
in the Law School): ENVIRON 270, Environmental Economics,
and ENVIRON 274, Environmental Politics, plus 9 units of
science courses.
- For students in other NS professional programs, concentrate
on using your 24 NS credits to take core science courses
plus quantitative courses.
- Although the Nicholas School has no formal prerequisites
for admission to the JD/MA in Environment program, some
courses that JD/MA students are required to take (or may
want to take) do have prerequisites. For example, JD/MA
students interested in economics and policy are required
to take ENV 270, Resource and Environmental Economics,
which has as prerequisites a semester of college calculus
and an introductory economics course that includes microeconomics.
JD/MA students in other areas (e.g., ecology, ecotoxicology)
usually take a combination of science and analytical methods
courses. Although the choice of courses is flexible, JD/MA
students who lack prerequisites such as ecology and introductory
statistics will find that their choice of courses is limited.
Work closely with your NS advisor as soon as you begin
your JD/MA program in order to anticipate any prerequisites
you may need.
- A comprehensive written exam (6 credits) is required
near the end of your program (no later than reading
week of your final semester) for a total of 30 credits
from the NS. You’ll need to set up an examining committee
of 3 faculty members by the beginning of the semester in
which you intend to graduate. One should be your advisor,
and one (either a NS faculty or faculty from another Duke
department) should be from an area outside your main NS
interest. See the NS Assistant for Graduate Studies for
the Graduate School paperwork you’ll need to establish
your examining committee and have them sign off on successful
completion of your comprehensive exam.
- The MA in Environment may emphasize a variety of environmental
subjects.
Here is an example of a course
plan for a JD/MA concurrent degree
student >
MPP
- See note below on Graduate School enrollment requirements
- Nicholas faculty generally encourage concurrent MPP students
to choose MEM/MF programs other than Environmental
Economics and Policy in order to maximize the added
value of the concurrent degree, but it is nevertheless possible
to choose the EEP program for a concurrent MPP degree.
- Make sure your MPP summer internship after your 1st
yr will yield a client and topic for your MPP MP, since
it can be hard to find one later during your NS program.
- Get an MPP MP advisor early in the fall of your final
year, when the 2nd yr MPP students are doing so, in order
not to find potential advisors booked up later in
the fall term. Choose an advisor whose primary appointment
is in Public Policy.
- MPP encourages concurrent MPP students to participate in
the MPP masters project seminar at MPP during the second
fall semester (when you’ll probably be enrolled mainly
in the NS), whether you enroll for credit or not. Starting
with the Fall 08 concurrent students, these courses (PUBPOL
307 and 308) will be required for the MPP portion of the
concurrent degree.
MAT
- MAT students should take some NS courses as part of
their science courses for the MAT degree (these can
satisfy the substance of NS requirements, but the credits
count for the MAT).
- See note below on Graduate School enrollment requirements
Graduate School Enrollment (MAT, MPP)
The Graduate School requires that you be registered at
Duke continuously (or on official leave of absence). This
requirement is satisfied either by your registration in
your Graduate School degree program (MAT or MPP) or by your
registration in the Nicholas School (MEM or MF).
The Graduate School further requires that you be registered
in the Graduate School during the semester in which you complete
all your requirements for your Graduate School degree (MAT
or MPP). For MPP concurrent degree students who do the MPP portion
of their degree first, this means that you must register
in the Graduate School during the semester in which you will
complete your MPP masters project. Unless you complete your
MPP MP before you enroll in the NS, that means that you must
pay a Graduate School registration fee while you are enrolled
in the NS for your final semester. It also means that if
you pay your Graduate School registration fee, but then fail
to complete your MPP MP during that semester, you will have
to pay the Graduate School registration fee again during
the next semester when you actually finish the MPP. Therefore,
if you find yourself struggling to complete both your MPP
masters project and your NS masters project in what should
be your final semester, finish the MPP MP first (and, be
sure that you have turned in your non-thesis exam card for
the Graduate School by the MPP departmental deadline), because
the NS will allow you one semester’s
“grace” period to finish the NS MP without
charging you a continuation fee.
Students in either the MAT or MPP program who find themselves
using the NS “grace” period to finish their
NS MPs should make sure that they request a “concurrent
degree leave of absence” from the Graduate School
for the period until they complete all requirements for
both degrees
For more information, contact Lynn
Maguire, Director of Professional Studies or the Assistant
for Professional Studies
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